> A question about Market Makers?

A question about Market Makers?

Posted at: 2014-12-05 
You presume that "manipulation" always turns out in the favor of the manipulator. What happens when this manipulator commits millions of dollars to moving the market, and then the market goes the other way of its own accord?

From a common sense standpoint, and as a career market maker, would you really risk your money, future, career, and even prosecution on such a feeble-minded scheme, with only a 50:50 chance of it working? They have more sure ways to make money; already proven.

The markets are efficient, effective, and work according to known rule of law. Concentrating on an infrequent exception will get you nowhere.

You say, "So I guess that's obvious blatant manipulation."

If you're going to make an accusation, don't "guess." Define "manipulation" according to law, and state specifically which law was broken.

That's not market manipulation. That's how the market works. People rush into a stock until all the buy and sell orders are matched, leaving only a few orders that were at the lower price.

Not... really? Market makers are usually corporations that have automated trading systems in place, which use algorithms to create signals to trade. Manual large lots being traded are usually not by individuals, as they can't keep up; they usually do it for their own consistent profits.

Unless they're trading several tens of thousands of stock as market orders or above the ask/below the bid price, it's likely all of the different automated systems trading between one another, causing the price to fluctuate.

Different algorithms trade differently; some seek to pump up hype, and some seek value. There is also the fact that these same systems are capable of scalping, which also affects the Bid:Ask spread.

These systems don't "plan" on changing a stock's price; they "plan" on gaining from hype and large price movements.

For example, five systems could be set to trigger if the stock suddenly jumps 1-2%, which pumps it up further, and then, another five systems could be set to trigger if the stock jumps 3-4%, which drags it down.

This problem usually occurs for day trading, and outside of market hours (you will notice large volumes of trades happening after the market closes, likely due to dark pools).

so what if you're right - if the government does it, it is not illegal.

I noticed that there is a lot of manipulation going on by the Market Makers.

Sometimes, it seems like these guys have a predetermined plan for the price movement of a stock.

For example, sometimes during intra-day, a stock would move up on heavy volume over the course of 4 - 5 ticks.

Then, all of a sudden it would just crash and erase all gains - and all it took was just 1 stick and light volume.

So I guess that's obvious blatant manipulation.

It almost seems like these guys have a predetermined master plan for the price movement of the stock....am I right?